About Krita and Gimp, in default installation

The removal of GIMP from the default installation of Ubuntu has raised quiet a stir. And as drawn quiet a bit of advertisement for Krita, as some people suggested the use of Krita instead, but for no good reasons, since Krita is not a good replacement for GIMP as a default installation.

You have to consider the use case of the default installation, since the Ubuntu people are trying to make is a distribution that is usefull for the average users, the default installation need to cover the need of the many. And what most people want to do with their picture is to classify them, do light weight retouching (for instance, adjust the brightness, remove red eyes) and then print the image or send it on the Internet. Surely, both Krita and GIMP can do it, but they have way more features than what is needed for most users. As Sven Neumann, one of the core GIMP developer, said GIMP is a high-end application for professionals, and so is Krita. Some might think that Krita has a GUI that is more friendly to the beginner, but that is not the problem, it is still packed with features that are of no interest to most users. And there are tools that are better suited to accomplish the task of those users, this is why a pictures collection management tool, such as F-Spot or Digikam is a much better choice, it covers the main usage of the majority of users. Even if Digikam is designed for professional photographer, I still think it scale nicely to average users. And when the user want to do more with images, he can just go to his favorite package manager, and install GIMP or Krita.

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16 Responses to About Krita and Gimp, in default installation

  1. Nost says:

    I would use Digikam, since F-Spot uses Mono, which has known license/freedom problems.

  2. Aaron Seigo says:

    For a default installation, Gwenview with Kipi plugin support is even better. You just point it at the images on disk and use Kipi to modify them. It’s the benefit of using Digikam for this without forcing all the additional UI around albums and what not that are required for a pro-app like Digikam.

  3. Kubuntiac says:

    Couldn’t agree more. People are mistakenly looking at this as a question of whether The Gimp is good or not. It’s excellent. It’s also completely unnecessary and intimidating to average users. People have pointed out that Windows comes with MS Paint, but look at how much simpler that is than either Gimp or Krita! (Both of which rock for high end stuff). People have said it’s catering to the lowest common denominator, but ignored that the *average* user is different from the *lowest common* denominator between users. Its where *most* users are, not the absolute lowest technical level of user that exists. Most users know how to play a cd, crop photos, upload a video to YouTube, browse the web and edit a word processing document. They have no clue though about alpha masks, colour profiles, script-fu and wacom tablets.

    Anyway. To summarise, I couldn’t agree more (as an artist).

  4. Kubuntiac says:

    +1 on Gwenview, too.

  5. Nost says:

    #2 Are we talking about Ubuntu or Kubuntu? Using Gwenview (or Krita, or whatever) as part of the default installation in Ubuntu would be a pain in the ass, because it needs Qt, kdelibs, etc…

  6. Lindsay says:

    >Mono, which has known license/freedom problems.

    Bollocks. Pure uninformed FUD.

  7. The license of Mono is beside the point, I do not think anyone will ever agree on that, anyway, even lawyers are divided on the question. But I am sure Cannonical legal department did a review of the legal issue and think it was ok to ship F-Spot. And if that change, they still have the option to switch back to Gimp or use Gwenview or Digikam 😉

  8. Nost says:

    Lindsay :
    >Mono, which has known license/freedom problems.
    Bollocks. Pure uninformed FUD.

    Uninformed? Who’s the owner of C# patents?

  9. Tommy.S says:

    First I want to remind it is a “digiKam” and not “Digikam” (and I personally like the first one as it is now =)

    The question is littlebit hard. Avarage joe does not need GIMP features, the F-spot is enough. But removing GIMP, they just made a LiveCD to be such you could not edit images on different computer on the road.

    There are actually four versions what would be comparable.

    – F-spot
    – Picasa
    – Gwenview
    – digiKam

    The F-spot is tied to Mono. Not good. It is slow, it crash and it actually does not have all features nicely packaged. And it even has hardcoded ~/Photos folder so it does not follow localisation. What is very bad by usability. Tagging is harder because it is just too simple.

    Picasa is closed source. Does not look so nice but has all features what avarage user would need. Rating is limited and tagging by same way.

    Gwenview is great but it needs Kipi-plugins to work well. Tagging would be done only by nepomil and rating as well. Dont know how well those write tags to EXIF. But it has almost all needed features as well. But it actually needs more the dolphin to be usefull on big albums.

    digiKam is best of all these. It has almost all features what you can wait for such software. (I need to ask why digiKam is not official KDE software?!). It only miss layer masks and fixing a few usability things to get straight software. It has lots of potential but still it manages to get the UI keeping simple. What it would need is possibility to have somekind “avarage joe” mode. But that could be avoided if digiKam gets the sidepanels working better way. Mayby more like the amarok has?

    but the ubuntu is a distribution focused to use Gnome. So Gwenview and digiKam does not work there because they need too much space for KDE platform. Picasa does not fit to UI and needs the wine. So there is nothing more left than F-spot. So it is F-spot or nothing. It is better than nothing so stick with it. Because GIMP does not offer anykind photo collectioning. It is problematic for normal user.

  10. Paul Boddie says:

    Another “advertisement” for F-Spot here:

    http://lwn.net/Articles/359579/

  11. Morty says:

    Aaron Seigo :It’s the benefit of using Digikam for this without forcing all the additional UI around albums and what not that are required for a pro-app like Digikam.

    Guess what you want is ShowPhoto, the image editor from Digicam in it’s stand alone mode :-)

  12. Rubenmv says:

    And why not gthumb?
    It can replace “Eye of gnome”, “F-Spot” and even “GIMP” on basic operations like cropping, resizing, removing red eyes, edit color, brightness and saturation, etc.
    Is similar to Gwenview but without the need of QT and KDE libs.

  13. Christoph says:

    digiKam is official KDE software, like KOffice or k3b. It lives in /kde/trunk/, uses bugs.kde.org as its bugtracker, and uses every other piece of the infrastructure that KDE offers (translation and documentation teams etc).

    It just isn’t released in the same 6 months cycles as the (now called) KDE SC. Looking how fast the digiKam team makes releases, it just would not make sense anyway.

  14. freedomsoftware says:

    @Tommy.S “So there is nothing more left than F-spot.” Uhhh… EyeOfGnome? gThumb? There’s a bunch of alternatives..

    Personally I’d enjoy seeing them all move over to Gwenview + Kipi plugins… which need kdelibs… meaning that all of Ubuntu would eventually have to move to KDE as there “wasn’t room for mono and an orange desktop environment on the disk” 😉

    Before the flames erupt: ***Yes, I’m Joking!***

  15. philippe says:

    <<most people want to do with their picture is to classify them, do <<light weight retouching (for instance, adjust the brightness, remove <<red eyes)

    i am very happy to read this. today i am no more alone.
    see the comment i written about a new tool in digikam
    **********************************************************
    i am happy for photo geek (about this new tool)
    but non photo geek wants only
    – to experiment emotion with souvenir
    – to live closer together with its family and friends
    then
    non photo geek wants :
    – a good gui
    – a mean to organize and to find easily photos
    – a mean to share photos
    non geek has low interest about fixing photos
    non geek has hich interest in : digikam must be included seamlessly in the workflow among the other tools in particular web photo cms.
    For example :
    – not to have error in exif data about rotation
    – for picasaweb it must be functionaly complete then must be able to send all tags for photos and movies
    many thanks for your works
    and
    be more Proust-ian (yes i also like madeleine)
    ************************************************************

  16. digiKam being a KDE application does not mean it cannot be used on other desktop. That is the whole point of the rebranding, KDE is a community that develop software to be used on KDE Desktop, Gnome, XFCE, Windows, Mac OS X…

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